From Stark
It turns out that the Bellingham fireworks ban backers have had a website and online petition up and running since April 2010.
In that time, they have garnered 436 signatures with a low-key, word-of-mouth campaign.
Don’t assume that this initiative effort is doomed to failure. If they can get the signatures to put their measure before city voters, their chances may be good.
Olympia voters faced a similar measure just last November, and they passed it by a 57 percent margin.
Many of Bellingham’s dog and cat owners are going to rally to this cause.
John, do you know for sure that they intend to follow the city charter requirements for a petition, for some reason methinks online petitions don’t follow the city charter?
AFY!!theheelotsheepdog!!!
Just to be clear: they are ready to do the legal petition process. Expect to see the petition soon on a clipboard near you.
The online thing has no legal force. It’s just a chance for people to express themselves.
Even on their own site they point out that on new years the existing law did little to curb the use of illegal fireworks. This law will not accomplish their goals and will take a revenue steam from local charities that sell fireworks in the city.
Then they can sell something else that does not do so much damage.
Sell something else!!!
What we have now is a sham. We sell what we call Safe and Sane fireworks that are neither. The small amount that non-profits make can be made up easily in other ways. The real issue is the proliferation of illegal fire works and the revision of a few years back allowing them only two days a year is a joke and a cruel joke at that. We have a Bellingham Municipal Code that says people have a right to peace in their homes. This illegal activity invades all of us for more than two weeks, twice a year.
It’s time to get serious with a ban and the enforcement that it will take to let people know we are serious. Fire companies patroling the neighborhoods, extra police patrols, there is plenty we can do. Imagine the BPD spending what we just spent to bring riot police to oust peaceful portestors on actual fire works, illegal fire works, enforcement. This is activity that actually hurts people and critters. They wouldn’t even need to wear the riot gear, just get on their motorcycles and patrol the neighborhoods and write a few citations.
How great is it that our own Councilor Snapp sees the idiocy behind police riot squads rousting peaceful protesters from a Public Space?
Very effen great.
Roadblocks at each end of the Res to confiscate illegal fireworks taken off site
would put such a dent the mess that those same Intrepid Public Servants
could easily control the few scofflaws left with casual patrols just as he says.
People should be able to leave the Res and drive to any number of places that aren’t Bellingham before actually doing anything with their fireworks. So the road block idea is not the right fix.
Did this group get turned away from any public hearing at City Council?
Wouldn’t Stan Snapp and the rest of the City Council enjoy a lively evening Public Hearing of locals spouting colorful invective about “America”, rights and runned over cats, blinded one eyed kids, Injuns, ER visits, and such? It sounds way more entertaining than debating the fate of plastic bags.
It is usual for potential speakers to head to a local taverns first, prior to marching to City Council with torches to such a lively hearing, to get parched throats wet in order to speak more eloquentially and with authority.
Mr. Snapp, we need this public hearing!
We need roadblocks, a cop on every corner, bigger jails, let’s throw everybody in jail that don’t do exactly as we want!
Fine them, hunt them down like the dogs they are! We have the resources, nothing is more important!
Let’s make our Nanny republic a police state; it sure seems to work for the Banana republic’s, don’t ya know!
AFY!!theheelotsheepdog!!!
to Victorvictor…
you could assemble the same impressive display for skateboards, bicycles, home repair tools, cooking equipment / knives / stoves, keeping of pets, liquor, and dozens of other common things that are extremely dangerous in the hands of idiots or negligent folks.
The tough part is usually finding the balance between the fear of bad conduct by the few bad apples, versus the rights of the rest of the populace to do normal things that you need to be careful when doing.
Is it a very high percentage of fireworks users who have harm to themselves and others? Is the harm really unavoidable? Could the matter be alleviated by harsh and strict enforcement of existing law about harming yourself or others?
If those questions can be honestly answered that a fireworks ban is in order, then so be it.
The fact is that in many parts of the country, the kind of wide-open fireworks situation we have in Bellingham would be unthinkable. I was amazed by it after I moved here. In many places, bans have been on the books as long as anyone can remember, and they have always been strictly enforced, although of course there will always be violations of any law.
My question about fireworks in the city is this: What’s the upside to it, in exchange for the risks, not just to the user, but to the neighborhood? What’s the upside we get in exchange for the public nuisance?
Guns are legal in the city, but if you want to open fire, you have to go to the rifle range or to a suitable hunting-targetry venue outside the city.
This does seem important to you John, and if this is what the citizens of Bham think is really important enough for a community wide debate then those who go out and pass the petitions, get enough valid signatures to put it on the ballot and have an up or down vote should be commended, however IMHO advocating roadblocks etc may not be the best political decision and you must also know, some of us feel:
You will only take me sparklers from me cold dead hands!
AFY!!theheelotsheepdog!!!
AFY – if it allowed sparklers would you support it?
While we did our share of loud fireworks in years past, I stopped after a harmless-looking ‘buzzing bee’ firework chased my daughter down the sidewalk, burning a hole in her sweatshirt. Those things happen fast. And these days we have a dog and I see it through her eyes. She is TERRIFIED and shaking for the 1 or 2 weeks of bombing that goes on in our neighborhood.
Then there’s the litter – it’s really a LOT of litter. The people who set off fireworks for weeks on end never seem inclined to sweep up the mess afterwards.
Lisa are you really gonna make me be civil, that’s no fun at all!
I’s must admit, it (our fireworks) was an eye opening experience (in many ways) once I moved here, you see my neighborhood is likely one of the most egregious, just don’t know how that would be?
For me to support it, I would have to look at existing law and then look at this proposal and see if it has any merit, does it overreach and does it have any hope of any type of success at all in accomplishing anything positive besides being another useless law of which we have too many. A big issue would be cost and how it would it be enforced.
I am totally against more nanny laws (those that protect us from ourselves or take away our choices) however IMHO government is here to protect us from the not so responsible amongst us as long as it does not penalize those of us who are responsible.
In the meantime everyone should do what I do:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rickvug/495881/
AFY!!theheelotsheepdog!!!
Well, like Lisa, I’ve done my share of fireworks in some years, especially when my kids were of a certain age…and like you, AFY, I think this is one that the people should decide.
I have no dogs or cats and don’t really get bent out of shape about the fireworks in town–I’m mostly resigned to it. The after-midnight blasts are annoying, and one year I found a spent skyrocket on my roof.
I’m just trying to make the point that in an awful lot of places in the USA, the kind of fireworks atmosphere we have in Bellingham would be considered unconscionable. It is not really the norm.
No argument John but most communities are not right next to an Indian Reservation. There a funny thing about reality, it’s reality!
But there are silver linings to dark clouds, you see I’s got a few pyromaniac’s in me family and at certain times of the year they look at Whatcom as a vacation spot, so fireworks can be giving our tourism industry a boost, don’t ya know!
Headed to the gym!
AFY!!theheelotsheepdog!!!
Spokane has had a ban for years, and they have pretty close access to reservations as well. Does anyone have first-hand experience with the success of the ban in
Spokane? (I’m guessing that Spokane residents, having to cope with a much drier climate, take a less tolerant view of pyrotechnics…)
It’s illegal to have Indian fireworks off the Res. so that’s a simple fix – enforce the law through confiscation.
Is there a right to burn anything else outdoors at any time?
How about a right to explode things in your neighborhood?
Are you responsible for the trash, the noise, the smoke and the disruption to your neighbors?
Does Not having a pet make you immune from the cruelty imposed on pets by your actions?
No wonder we need an SPCA and too bad they can’t round-up human animals.
John, that would be a good bit of information to have if it ain’t just spin.
There is one thing about a public debate of what a successful petition drive does, you get to hear all sides, there is also some education related, and current policy gets reviewed. IMHO nothing will be successful that a majority of the community does not support.
Where so many petitions lose it, is by going too far for what the electorate will accept.
Some Pot petitions have been a good example of that in the past.
AFY!!theheelotsheepdog!!!
Looking at the group’s website it appears several towns/cities near reservations have banned fireworks: Yakima, Selah, Toppenish, Union Gap, Tacoma, Anacortes, Burlington.
It also looks like they did a thorough job of contacting fire chiefs in those various towns to see how the ban has worked out. If you go to their blog and click on the pages indexed on the right, you can see the fire chiefs’ responses published.
And here’s another blog/opinion about fireworks laws:
“We could put this imaginary stack of “blown off fingers” next to the pile of “eyes put out with B-B guns,” and have a carnage almost equal to the mysterious and un-named legions of folks killed by second-hand smoke…
…When nanny-state liberals conspire to deprive folks of their liberties, they shouldn’t be surprised at the negative reaction generated. Next New Year’s Eve and next 4th of July, you can expect to see and hear just as many fireworks as in the past. And, come next election day, some of our Nanny Councilmen may find unexpected fireworks.
http://www.louisville.com/content/louisville-mayor-vetoes-fireworks-ordinance-opinion-arena
AFY!!theheelotsheepdog!!!