Local PoliSci prof hits NYT Op-Ed piece
Full disclosure: Todd Donovan is a Western Washington University political science professor that is a source of mine. He’s basically the only local source for local elections. Donovan is invaluable, has a lot of experience and knows his stuff. He’s also quite liberal and is a member of the Washington Conservation Voters. Because of that, sometimes I don’t interview him because he supports candidates who are supported by that group. That includes people like Ken Mann, Dan McShane, Laurie Caskey-Schreiber and Carl Weimer.
So he’s a good source, who really kills my mojo, man.
Anyway, today, David Brooks, the conservative New York Times columnist has included Donovan in his story about the effects of Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck on the electorate:
In 2008, after McCain had won his nomination, Limbaugh turned his attention to the Democratic race. He commanded his followers to vote in the Democratic primaries for Hillary Clinton because “we need Barack Obama bloodied up politically.” Todd Donovan of Western Washington University has looked at data from 38 states and could find no strong evidence that significant numbers of people actually did what Limbaugh commanded. Rush blared the trumpets, but few of his Dittoheads advanced.
Over the years, I have asked many politicians what happens when Limbaugh and his colleagues attack. The story is always the same. Hundreds of calls come in. The receptionists are miserable. But the numbers back home do not move. There is no effect on the favorability rating or the re-election prospects. In the media world, he is a giant. In the real world, he’s not.
Read the entire column, right here.
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:28 PM
A little more on Operation Chaos!
My inlaws (proud members of operation Chaos) in their 80’s who have voted GOP forever did in Virginia, cast votes for Hillary, so maybe those surveys were off just a little bit! I reckon we will never know for sure!
AFY!!thesheepdog!!!
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:34 PM
ST, please don’t call Brooks a conservative it’s insulting! That’s like calling GWB a conservative!
NEWS Flash!!
Acorn to partner with Roman Polanski on daycare center chain!!
http://www.aconservativelesbian.com/
AFY!!thesheepdog!!!
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:51 PM
Who would waste their vote appeasing the sweaty hands of Rush Limbaugh?
Beck, Hannity et al are simply squeaky wheels that beg to be greased.
That they aren’t even attached to the wagon doesn’t seem to matter.
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:54 PM
Not even remotely funny, sheepdog.
Yer losing it bigtime if you think that’s apropos.
You may need to take a step back and re-examine your sensibilities..
October 2nd, 2009 at 5:37 PM
Sam, you’re right about Brooks. He’s the only conservative columnist I read regularly. He’s thoughtful and sensible, the exact opposite of Bill Kristol (no wonder the NYTimes dumped Kristol!)
It’s quite an honor to be recognized as a solid source by a writer of Brooks’ caliber; Donovan does indeed have reason to be proud.
October 2nd, 2009 at 6:36 PM
Since we’re getting a little off topic, why do conservatives hate America?
“Upon being informed of the news, (Chicago losing it’s bid to host the 1016 Olympics) a gathering of conservatives at the Americans For Prosperity — one of the main organizing groups behind the tea party protests — erupted in applause.”
See the video here:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/02/conservatives-revel-in-ob_n_307794.html
October 2nd, 2009 at 7:27 PM
Way to go Todd! (And thanks for replacing my Obama yard sign last fall after some nimnum ripped off a bunch of them in our neighborhood.)
October 2nd, 2009 at 8:24 PM
Loooking asks, ” why do conservatives hate America?” IMO it’s because they love power more than anything in the universe, and now that they have lost power their hatred has exploded to encompass everything and everybody other than themselves. They are totally negative (severely maladjusted) personalities.
Contrary to widespread opinion, I don’t think they’re racist. They’re just extreme right wingers, doing their thing. They would NOT be acting this way if Colin Powell or Condi Rice were president. They don’t hate Obama because he’s black, Beck’s lies notwithstanding. They hate him because he is not a Republican/Libertarian/teabagger/anarchist/chronic malcontent - in other words, he is not one of them.
October 3rd, 2009 at 12:33 AM
Wrong on Colin Powell but very right on Condi Rice!
AFY!!thesheepdog!!!
October 3rd, 2009 at 7:56 AM
That clip from the extreme right wing gang clearly demonstrates that these people have raised schadenfreude to new depths.
October 3rd, 2009 at 9:22 AM
Or as gramma used to say before we put her down, “They’d cut off their nose to spite their own face.”
October 3rd, 2009 at 10:50 AM
David Brooks liberal enthuseasum, confuses his logic. He equates Conservative shock jocks inability to command their listeners to vote for any one candidate, as “hollowness”.
Hollowness is the wrong word. The correct word is “leadership”, which is simply defined as the ability to influence others. They do not have influence, they have listeners.
The truth is at the core of this article is a kernel of envy. The liberal left cannot generate the listeners via talk radio that the conservative right has been so successful at.
Generating listeners is not power, its is entertainment ability. That’s right, liberals are not entertaining. See they are not laughing now. (This is humor)
Look at how successful funny liberal have been on television. It seems like resorting to hyperbole of gross exaggerations of an opposing view, only serves to turn off the independent audience. Humor is important.
I suspect that whatever perceived power that talking head from both extremes of the left and right thin they have, are turning off more voters today, than turning them on.
In other words the vocal groups from both ends of the political rectum are losing power and people tire of their rant, and recognize that neither of these groups are really accomplishing anything for most of us in the middle.
Rush and Move on are losing power, and I for one am happy about this. Thier voices are important to hear, as either group can make some great points and add to our political debate, but neither has the ability to bring Americans together, …
… and truly lead.
Ranting by either side is wearing thin. As ranting wears thin, listeners will drift off. Continuous pointing to the extremes, accomplishes little, as those in the middle are tired of being unfairly painted.
October 3rd, 2009 at 12:11 PM
Liberals are not entertaining like the pope isn’t catholic.
See?…You’re smiling right now.
October 3rd, 2009 at 12:45 PM
There is no such animal as The Middle.
October 3rd, 2009 at 4:32 PM
So it turns out that dittoheads are NOT mind-numbed robots Rushing off to do his bidding, after all.
October 3rd, 2009 at 8:06 PM
“In other words the vocal groups from both ends of the political rectum are losing power”
ROFLMAO!!!!!
October 3rd, 2009 at 8:12 PM
“So it turns out that dittoheads are NOT mind-numbed robots Rushing off to do his bidding, after all.”
You miss Brooks’ point, Spinner. What he’s saying is the slavish, brain dead little Dittoids DO rush off to do his bidding, but that it has no meaningful effect.
Once in a while I endure a few minutes of Limbaugh the Liar, just to monitor the enemy, and I’m always dumbfounded to think there are people who actually buy into his BS. Go figure…
October 4th, 2009 at 2:03 PM
“Once in a while I endure a few minutes of Limbaugh the Liar, just to monitor the enemy, and I’m always dumbfounded to think there are people who actually buy into his BS. Go figure…”
Sounds like your head is covered by aluminum foil, to keep any facts from entering your brain.
October 4th, 2009 at 3:20 PM
Malcolm - as far as I can tell, your e-mail address is not legitimate at all. Therefore, every post you’ve made in recent weeks has disappeared. They will continue to do so until you use a legit address in which I get a reply to my e-mails seeking confirmation. If it is legit, and there is an issue between my e-mail and yours we can work it out, but I don’t think it is. Otherwise, you should consider continuing to use your other two fake names, which I know you have legit e-mail addresses for.
October 5th, 2009 at 7:31 AM
Leonard Pitts devoted his column on Saturday to calling out Faux News for some of its most egregious lies:
http://www.miamiherald.com/living/columnists/leonard-pitts/story/1264553.html#none
October 5th, 2009 at 11:10 AM
So its the usual pile of liberal bile - when are any one of you going to post something founded on fact? You are tolerant only of your own misbegotten opinions. Have you even bothered to find out about the latest two czars appointed by himself and Janet Napolitano to Homeland Security - both Muslims? I guess you don’t much care, just so long as you can go on badmouthing the voices you fear the most and projecting your jaundiced opinions where they don’t fit..
October 5th, 2009 at 11:30 AM
Gee, madbee, talk about your cut and paste conservative rant. Leonard Pitts isn’t the most eloquent columnist but he does seem to list specific factual errors (okay, they’re outright lies) on specific dates that have appeared on Fox News. Do you care to do the same?
You do realize, also, that a “czar” is not actually a czar, with the dictatorial powers and all, but just a label given by the media and that every president since Carter has been appointing them.
October 5th, 2009 at 11:45 AM
Since Nixon actually.
October 5th, 2009 at 1:33 PM
Oh my.
Madbee raises the legitimate issue that posts should be “founded on fact.” S/he then states what s/he believes to be a fact — that two high-level federal bureaucrats are “both Muslims.” I don’t have any idea whether this is, in fact, a fact, but let’s assume that it is.
Madbee critically fails to state the implication of these facts. From the context, s/he believes that the implications are so heinous that they should lead us all to embrace Rush Limbaugh. The implications could be heinous because (1) there is a religious litmus test for service in the federal government, and Muslims are banned (not a fact), or (2) Muslims are not allowed to serve in the federal government because they are all uneducated and incapable (not a fact), or (3) Muslims shouldn’t serve in the federal government because they are all terrorists (not a fact), or (4) Muslims must be banned from government . . .just because (not a fact).
Rather than a factual discussion, what we have is an example of a “misbegotten opinion” that focuses on”badmouthing the voices you fear the most and projecting your jaundiced opinions.” I’m not persuaded that I should rely on the sources that influence Madbee.
October 5th, 2009 at 2:48 PM
The real problem is that many people today make absolutely no distinction (nor know how, or why it’s important) between what they *believe* and what’s factual.
For all too many, I believe” = “It’s true” and the converse, “I don’t believe that” = “you lie”
Belief-based ‘discussions’ (and commenters) are frustrating, impervious to learning and listening, and often a waste of time. To paraphrase a quote I saw recently on a bulletin board in a St. Joe’s elevator, “Logic and facts will never change a prejudice. Predjudice is an emotional belief that reason and logic had nothing to do with creating, so can’t be undone by education.”
October 5th, 2009 at 4:59 PM
I’m not sure who penned that little quote, but it’s absurd.
Maybe the author meant YOU can’t change anyone’s prejudice.
But prejudice is conquered every day of the week through experience,
which is education personified.
There isn’t anything that can’t be undone through the right kind of lesson,
even if it draws blood.
October 5th, 2009 at 6:07 PM
I would never die for my beliefs, because I might be wrong.
- Bertrand Russell
October 5th, 2009 at 6:10 PM
Actually, Loooking, I believe even FRD had “czars” and they were referred to that way by the media then. It is, indeed, a media term.
October 5th, 2009 at 6:46 PM
The problem I had with Pitts column about Fox (faux) news was that he was equating their opinion people (O’Reilly, Hannity, Beck) to news people.
October 5th, 2009 at 7:43 PM
Hey Sam. Why don’t you start an open thread on your blog now and then, especially at times when you’re going to be away. I just ran into this disturbing site (thanks to Slog): the Christian wikipedia.
http://www.christopedia.us/Main_Page
October 5th, 2009 at 8:35 PM
Loooking, thanks for the link. As a recovering Southern Baptist, I feel qualified to express my honest reaction: BARF!!!!
October 5th, 2009 at 8:45 PM
Odyssey, I think Pitts made his feelings clear when he called Faux News “a news channel in name only,” which is 100% accurate. It’s then axiomatic that the bloviators on that sickening medium are extreme right wing polemicists, propagandists, rabble rousers, and liars - anything BUT news reporters!
October 5th, 2009 at 9:00 PM
I equate O’Reilly et al to Keith Olberman and Rachel Maddow. None of these are news people.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:56 PM
There’s that false equivalence….there’s no way Keith and Rachel stoop to the same level that you get from Fox. Keith’s monologues do ramble on for far too long, but they’re usually dead on. On the other hand, I don’t have cable and don’t watch anyone regularly anymore.
October 6th, 2009 at 11:10 AM
I wonder what your poli sci prof thinks about the article in WSJ about the Republican lawmakers demanding that Democrat candidates return SEIU contributions because of the close ties between ACORN and SEIU. The SEIU was started by ACORN in 1982, as the State Employees Union and then the Service employee branch was added in the ninties. I believe that the Rathke bros headed both the SEIU and ACORN, until the embezzlement was uncovered. Recent developments in that case indicate that the embezzlement involved 5 million dollars, not one million and whether or not it was federal, state or private money has yet to be determined. Wade Rathke is in Bangkok and hasn’t been able to be reached for comment on the new indictments in the case.
The ties between the SEIU and ACORN could have potential ramifications to the health care bill. Would you or your prof friend like to comment?
October 6th, 2009 at 1:28 PM
John Galt you seem to consider yourself an expert on ACORN. But when you said Gregoire owed her election to ACORN and I challenged you to cite your “source,” you cut and ran. Are you ready to answer my question now?
October 6th, 2009 at 3:47 PM
So how say you, Mr Galt? Now that you’ve gone totally off topic on this thread and steered the discussion to ACORN - your obsession - are you ready to offer some proof of your accusation re Gregoire? Put up or shut up!
October 6th, 2009 at 6:26 PM
Out of town this week, but just wanted to let all me friends know I ‘m thinkin of ya!
http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/entertainment/snl-takes-a-dig-at-obamas-accomplishments_100257032.html
AFY!!thesheepdog!!!
October 6th, 2009 at 6:38 PM
I know it’s true that every election that results in a bad outcome can be blamed on ACORNS and their seed.
Rush Limbaugh pointed out that they even tried to stuff fake IOC ballots in Denmark, how low can you get?
October 6th, 2009 at 8:27 PM
No wonder “John Galt” has cut and run…AGAIN! A quick check of wikipedia shows his attacks on ACORN, SEIU, Obama, etc etc etc ad nauseum are pure fabrications (AKA BS!)
SHEESH! Facts are kryptonite* to those people!
[*NOTE: I've dumbed down my comment to comic book level for the benefit of some readers...]
October 7th, 2009 at 7:40 AM
Wikipedia … now there’s an authoritative source.
October 7th, 2009 at 8:33 AM
Wikipedia … now there’s an authoritative source.
Yes, it is! About 100 times more authoritative than the right wing echo chamber where Limbaugh the Liar and Beck the Buffoon compete for the honor of Screamer In Chief…
October 7th, 2009 at 9:17 AM
Wikipedia now has fact checkers that verify user submissions.
But anything’s better than Not Responding when asked for a source.
October 7th, 2009 at 10:07 AM
Actually, “Dumbing down to the comic book level” doesn’t mean the same thing it used to be. “Watchmen”, a very popular comic book, was on Time Magazine’s top 100 novels of the Century. Y the Last Man, Love and Rockets, and Sandman, all comic books have won series literary awards in the last couple decades and more modern comic series such as “Planetary” and “Fables” continue to be critically acclaimed. The market for comics has shifted from 12 year old boys looking for capes and crusaders, to an older audience, with more complex art, darker stories and layers of symbolism.
Yes, I am a fan, but times have changed.
October 7th, 2009 at 11:58 AM
dear looking - here are the names of the “czars” a.k.a. unvetted appointees not electees - Assistant Secretary Policy Development Source - Arif Alikhan,
Kareem Shora [Syrian born] ADC National Executive Director as a member of the Homeland Security Advisory Council; - the announcement of the above appointments by Janet Napolitano was made proudly by the American Arab Anti- Discrimination Committee. There now - is that better?
October 8th, 2009 at 4:27 PM
Madbee, you still didn’t explain why — based on fact, not prejudice — the fact that these Americans, one of whom apparently was born in Syria, are serving in the federal government is bad. Didn’t want you to think that your post was the last word on the subject, and don’t want any Americans of Syrian heritage in the Bellingham area to take your apparent outrage as the norm in our community.