http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-_SGGcJu_c&feature=related

Now if you want single payer which is government health care, it is your choice, myself, I think all it would be doing is adding costs and ending up looking more like England’s or Canada’s systems, which I believe to be a huge step down from what we have today.

What we have today needs improvement, but I don’t see putting government or insurance more into the mix will solve our problems but will only make it worst. I would like to see us headed towards eliminating/reducing the third party as much as possible, whether it’s government or insurance companies, to allow the consumers to have more say. To me it does not matter if a D or a R promotes such a program just that is the direction of reform I would support.

Both of the current bills are going in the direction that methinks is the wrong direction towards more government involvement.

Health care is not as complicated as some would make it:

http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/06/health_care_is_not_that_compli.html

AFY!!thesheepdog!!!

That is why I’m pretty much all for increasing taxes and buying bonds, to pay for everything that I/we have and use already.

I can’t believe sometimes the number of people who don’t even see the incongruity of saying both “Lower taxes!” and “Reduce the debt!”, or worst of all, advocate an interventionalist military.

Those clunkers aren’t going to save homes and are not going to reduce smoking. They will, however, make you feel good, at great, unproductive, expense.

The deficit is $1.4 trillion. Doesn’t that get your attention? Do you have children? Are you happy to load them up with this debt?

The polls would suggest otherwise. Keep drinking the Kool-aid.

Since the Democrats won enough Senate seats to stop Republican filibusters and actually bring bills to the floor, they’ve given us the Credit CARD Act of 2009, which was long, long overdue.

Finally, some desperately needed consumer protection against abusive credit card issuers!

You can read more about that bill here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_CARD_Act

Congress also passed the Weapon Systems Acquisition Reform Act of 2009, which promises to reduce billions of dollars in waste and cost overruns in defense contracts.

They also enacted the Helping Families Save Their Homes Act of 2009 and the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act.

After healthcare reform, they are going to get to work on financial regulation and even more consumer protections against the worse abuses of the financial sector, such as predatory and fraudulent lending practices.

If they keep this up, maybe Democrats will actually expand their majorities in both the House and Senate in 2010!

Further, what I am seeing is enough concessions to the few serious Republicans of gravitas that I am getting a little POed that the Dems can’t grow a pair and exercise their mandate and let the naysayers chew on it.

The government is never going to take over the health care industry. What will happen is industry will adapt. Right now it is about half serious and half flim flam artists. Insurance people are the flim of the flam along with the guy making a simple prosthetic tool for .15 cents and selling it for $5. Serious medicine will remain and can only improve. In case you all have forgotten, moving ahead and solving problems and righting wrongs and advancing rather than declining has always been our tradition as a nation when we listen to our better angels. We are just following our tradition of making our national nest ever better.

Therefore you have no proof that government will intrude to your detriment. None! You have only fear and emotion. You see the same things I do but you chose to see gloom and doom and I chose to see promise.

Last point taken.

Here’s the deal, there are issues most of both sides agree on (like buying insurance across state lines) that could be passed without much of a fight right now and should be if we were really interested in reducing cost in health care. But it a all or nothing right now, this time or else!

IMHO this ain’t about health care, it is about the government in time taking over the health care business.

I’s don’t like big insurance between me and my doctor and I’s definitely don’t want big government filling that gap, to save money, to give people more say in their health care decisions is the only way in my book to save cost, not more government intrusions which leads to more cost and less choice!

AFY!! & Jurgen having a rational discussion, is it possible, we will see! Stay tuned folks!

AFY!!thesheepdog!!!

The politics of a democratic nation is the only way as people we have of even badly trying to create some consensus. Some have to be brought along slowly, and that is what has been going on for decades. Now it’s time to move, even if it isn’t to everyone’s liking, it is a start past due.

Our health-care system suffers from problems of cost, access and quality, and needs major reform. Tax policy drives employment-based insurance; this begets overinsurance and drives costs upward while creating inequities for the unemployed and self-employed. A regulatory morass limits innovation. And deep flaws in Medicare and Medicaid drive spending without optimizing care.

From the previous link.

AFY!!thesheepdog!!!

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704431804574539581994054014.html

There are reasons health care costs are going up and these bills in congress will not correct that, and I truly feel sorry for anyone who thinks they will.

So much effort in the wrong direction still means yous are headed in the wrong direction!

AFY!!thesheepdog!!!

Throughout my life, I have never sought or accepted welfare, so I don’t know what you are talking about.

Let me tell you about an experience I had back in 2003. I accidentally cut the back of my thumb with a very sharp knife. It was a small cut, but I severed the tendon that allows you to lift your thumb, and I also cut the vein that runs along the top of your thumb. So even though I tried for several hours, I couldn’t get it to stop bleeding.

Because it was Sunday afternoon and I saw no other choice, I reluctantly went to the hospital emergency room. Altogether, the doctor spent less than five minutes with me. He put one suture in the tendon, and one in the vein and sent me home. Two weeks later, I got a bill from the hospital for over $5,000!

Anyone who has seen the charges on their hospital bills knows that our healthcare system is in dire need of reform. Anyone who has witnessed the dramatic rise in their health insurance premiums the past two decades knows that the current system is absolutely unsustainable.

Here’s another story for you: For several years before he died, my dad was dependent upon inhalers that he could buy in Mexico for $5 each, but those exact same inhalers cost $120 in the United States — all because our government is essentially in bed with the pharmaceutical companies and protecting them from competition. My dad’s friends used to come back from Mexico with inhalers by the bag full for him, and you can rest assured that the drug companies weren’t selling them at a loss south of the border.

It’s sad and tragic that radical, right-wing spin masters are working to protect the supernormal profits of corporate oligopolies by convincing honest, hard working people that an evil-doer in the White House is ramming a big, scary bill down their throats that is going to bankrupt the nation, while redistributing your wealth.

Instead of buying into the lies, why don’t you pull the wool from your eyes and trying looking at reality for a change?