By Stark
During this morning’s tour of the new airport terminal expansion, I asked Port of Bellingham Executive Director Charlie Sheldon if he was concerned about the impact of increased rail traffic on plans to redevelop the port’s waterfront real estate.
His answer? No.
Opponents of SSA Marine’s Gateway Pacific Terminal project proposed for Cherry Point have argued that the increase in rail traffic through the city would hamper port/city efforts to redevelop the waterfront acres left idle when Georgia-Pacific Corp. phased out its pulp and tissue mill operations, with tissue production stopping at the end of 2007.
While the rail line does run between those waterfront acres and the downtown area, Sheldon noted that traffic can pass over the tracks in the vicinity of Chestnut and Bay streets, and would also pass over the tracks at Cornwall Avenue if the BNSF main line is shifted away from the waterfront as now planned.
As Sheldon sees it, those access points will allow sufficient access to a redeveloped waterfront even if Gateway Pacific adds another 18 trains per day to local rail traffic.
“We spent six years planning this thing to be consistent with an active, main rail line,” Sheldon said.
About time someone not impeding progress with a misguided anti progress agenda.
….another Bob Ferris myth busted…
Well, that settles it. Now we can all go back to arguing over traffic cameras and bicycle lanes.
With all due respect to Charlie’s experience, there are many who hold different opinions on this aspect as well as a whole body of research on the impact of traffic levels and noise on property values and business success.
What would expect from this guy?
It’s his job to side with industrial development where ever he finds it.
He doesn’t care,
he doesn’t have to.
Taxpayers pay his salary, no matter what he does or doesn’t think.
If his living was on the line, he’d sing a different tune.
I wish we were able to post links on this thread but since we cannot I suggest that folks do a simple google search on train noise and property values. You’ll get literally thousands of hits from news stories about complaints about increasing train noise and how it impacts residential property values to scientific articles that try to establish a per 10db percentage of property drop. Folks want to live close to public transportation but not too close and with freight trains–particularly 24 hour traffic–the drops are substantial. And with 3.6 million sqft of residential property in the offing and 10,000 folks currently living in this corridor the drops in potential value and existing values will be substantial. Commercial real estate takes a hit too but those numbers are a little different in that being right on top of the tracks is good for some businesses that might have direct rail access.
Bob Ferris,
Links work just fine in these discussions, and many here demand a link to relevant material to support whatever argument you’re making.
The quality of the material linked to is sometimes a matter of discussion, of course.
The usual protocol is to quote an excerpt, a comment, and the link to the article.
For obvious reasons, I won’t comment, but I am really interested in the discussion.
It might not be enormously productive to comment on BNSF’s operations on its own right of way. I think that Mr. Sheldon’s comments about ways of crossing the right of way are informative.
Not unrecently, I sat at the Slater Road rail crossing as a 120-car train partially loaded with garbage from British Columbia sped by, headed south.
It is probably because the Port has the same issues at the airport. Allegiant owns the port and the jets fly over Ferndale.
No matter what you naysayers think, or try to say, and try to delay, you won’t win this one…
The Gateway terminal will happen!
And as far as the trains are concern…..
Why don’t you activist lay down on the railroad track and see if Burlington Northern slows down for you!
“…Sheldon noted that traffic can pass over the tracks…” I see that the Port official’s only reference is to at-grade and overpass crossings. As other commenters have noted, there are many other considerations of concern deriving from proximity to the rail line. Also, the Port official did not say what will (might) be done about the at-grade crossing at the southern end of the property – the one that runs steeply downhill from where N. State and N. Forest and Boulevard Streets come together.
Here is one:
http://www.downtowncondoshowroom.com/blog/?p=714
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1361920905000222
Here is another.
http://ideas.repec.org/a/bla/growch/v37y2006i3p460-488.html
Here is another http://trid.trb.org/view.aspx?id=790967
Another….http://www.worldtransitresearch.info/research/2081/
So David, it turns out that the problem was sending multiple links at once. How many do I have to send to make my point? Here is another (http://www.thehawkeye.com/Story/quiet_zone_111807). Since the clean up of the waterfront and its prognosis is so dependent on its ability to attract businesses and residents and the problems with rail traffic noise and property devaluations is so well documented, it seems logical that increases in traffic of the magnitude demanded by this project would greatly impact this project and other track-side properties and waterfront properties as well. Throw in the issue of diesel particulates and you have a serious problem for current and future inhabitants.
Please post train crossing anecdotes since they are sooo informative.
Use vague terms which fit your agenda and cannot be discussed factually.
Make bold statements from the authority of your imagination!
You too can be a Commissioner of Crap-science.
As opposed to your clearly elucidated counter arguments? Shooting the messenger is easy. And lazy. Not to mention mean spirited. It’s time to give Bob a break and raise the level of discourse. We all care about the community.
At least I timed the train’s crossing and the resultant delays at the Slater Road crossing.
And I posted the traffic counts for Slater Road at the same time for context.
I also counted the four engines pulling the 90 empty cars I watched hold up traffic for about 6 minutes.
Just because you’re mad at me doesn’t give you the right to misrepresent my comments.
Commissioner Onkels has been posting anecdotes for everything from prevailing winds to train crossings – I have posted facts which are easily referenced.
Charlie gave his honest opinion.
Bob Ferris has a different opinion and I am sure it is his honest opinion.
Both opinions should be respected.
But those who would denied others from voicing their opinions by shouting them down or attacking anyone they disagree with; they deserves no respect from any fair minded person.
The more civil discussion to be had; the better a solution may be found.
AFY!!theheelotsheepdog!!!
You don’t know that ‘Charlie gave his honest opinion’.
The man that has a vested financial interest isn’t usually the most candid when it comes to opinion.
Not losing your job is a good reason to be tactful instead of truthful.
Nobody here has ever shouted anyone down.
In light of this discussion I thought I would go back and look at the assumptions contained in the Draft EIS traffic studies and here is what they have to say:
“It is likely the number of trains operating on this railway would increase as freight and passenger demand increase in the future; however, the number that would operate in the future is unknown. BNSF typically adds one or two trains every five to ten years. Therefore, the increased usage of the rail would increase the instances when intersections experience long delays and queues as the rail passes through intersections. In addition, access to/from the New Whatcom site would be limited at certain time of the day potentially causing additional delays to emergency response vehicles. (New Whatcom Redevelopment Project Volume II Technical Appendices Draft EIS—Section “N” page 78)
I am not sure how this section which talks about increasing delays and a very modest increase in train traffic (i.e., at the high level 8 extra trains by 2027) can in anyway be construed to imply 1) that these higher numbers (18) have in any way been analyzed by the Port, and 2) that they can defensibly claim that this level will not have an impact on the success of this project.
Nice work, Mr. Ferris. Is it possible Mr. Sheldon has not read the Draft EIS for the waterfront?
And just what has Sheldon done to move the waterfront project along? or anyone for that matter…..we just can’t wait to be Harlan County.
Why would we want to do anything to bring tourists to town other than to see coal trains roll by…..and St. Joe’s has a great and growing community to deal with the medical effects of pollution…..
let’s just sen all of our resources to China, they will send products back. of course only the rich will be able to afford products and services, but if we reduce the tax on the rich down to Pawlenty’s wet dream of 25%, then theynwill be able to buy all the goods and pay for the minimum wage retail workers which is all we’ll need. The middle class will die off pretty quickly if they’re left to camping out at the rich people’s freeway underpasses and growing veggies on the medians….all we’ll need for that 25% is some troops and police to keep rebellions down until they’re gone ands we’ll just collect all the guns and pass them out only to the rich to defend themselves…..brave new world when one has the foresight of shrew….
So there are some quirky things about this iPad and maybe it’s interface that I have to figure out, like why did this poorly edited version post and the edited version did not…kerfuffle..
But the question remains, why is the waterfront project in the doldrums and this boondoggle getting all this attention….
Whatcom county, they think you are stupid…and they may be right…
Apologies to John Prine and other aspiring cover artists….
When I was a child my family would travel,
Down to Western Whatcom where my parents were born,
There’s a backwards old town that’s often remembered,
So many times that my memories are worn.
And daddy won’t you take me down to mule headed B’ham
Down where the blue Nooksack enters Old Lummi bay,
I’m sorry my son, but yer too late fer askin, Mr. Peabody’s coal trains have shat it to gray..
Then the coal shills came with the world’s largest shovels,
They tortured the logic and stripped all the sense,
They lied and they shoveled and confused all the lemmings, then they wrote it all down as the progress of man……
“I guess the times have changed, kids are different now
Cause some dont even seem to know that milk comes from a cow
My little boy can tell the names of all the baseball stars
I remember how we memorized the names on railroad cars
The Wabash and the TP, Lackawanna, the IC
The Nichel-Plate and the good old Santa Fe…
John Denver
AFY!!theheelotsheepdog!!!
I would add to my above comment that not only did the EIS for the waterfront not look at train numbers approaching what we might see, but there was no mention at all of the potential for coal trains which are a whole different beast with a special set of issues.
Ironic that Bellingham in now talking about coal trains running through a city that sits upon the remains of several coal mines. Interesting article on the hx of coal mining in bellingham:
http://www.klipsunmagazine.com/?p=1221
Bob Ferris you are on the WRONG TRACK… you talk as IF the choice were a railway or not. There is ALREADY a railway. It is my understanding that some trains already pass though town carrying coal to Canada’s coal terminal. It seems the REAL CHOICE is do you have the terminal and jobs in Bellingham or do we have them in Canada. The coal IS going to be mined and trains carrying it are going to pass through Bellingham and China and/or other countries ARE going to burn it.
So focus on the only issues remaining do you want the jobs and economic benefit in Bellingham or in Canada, eh?
The talk of train noise and global warming and so on are NOT the issues.. Those will or will not happen whether or not this terminal is built. By the way China already produces MORE CO2 than the USA, so any small dent we make in CO2 output in the USA has no measurable effect on global warming. By the way how deep was the ice over parts of Washington just 15,000 years ago? The globe has been warming for a long time. Oh and so have Mars and Venus…. So get off the global warming aspect of this project, it is just a greenie rallying cry for “don’t do anything”. Humans are as natural a part of global evolution as those nasty plants with chlorophyll that also changed the world.
LONDON, June 8 (Reuters) – China’s carbon dioxide emissions rose 10.4 percent in 2010 compared to the previous year as it surpassed the United States as the world’s biggest energy consumer,
http://af.reuters.com/article/energyOilNews/idAFLDE7570UF20110608
So if you folks aginst CO2 emiisions are serious go to China and protest there. You wil have no effect here except for preventing local economic benefit.
So, what happens if Japan immediately shuts down all of its nuclear plants as is being actively discussed? I.e. What if the Japanese convert to coal based power in the short term?
How many more Cole trains through down town Bellingham would that involve? Is this what Goldman Sachs is betting upon?
It appears that RCW 81.36.010 Right of eminent domain allows Rail Road companies to condemn private property to make for a nice new set of two tracks through downtown, Edgemoore, Eldredge, Larrabee Park, etc.
Is the Port Director unconcerned about BNSF’s attorneys taking a nice 60 foot additional right of way away from Port Plans? Maybe Goldman Sachs will requisition all of Edgemoore and Eldredge houses too! Patty Murray’s bill could pay for it.
It has long been thought that volcanoes produce more emissions than man, but among countries China leads the US by a little more than 2%’ even though their population dwarfs ours. And that will no doubt grow as their billions population grows. The US, which is more enlightened on this subject is already taking steps to reduce ours–and that alone probably accounts for the disparity. So the US is almost neck and neck though China has billions more people…not exactly a record to be proud of LaMarTek, but just because other developing countries are on the wrong track does not excuse our lameness and it doesn’t justify continuing to support retro industries of greedy throwbacks here for a handful of jobs. we can be smarter and do our part to put a stopper in. Your idea that since it will happen anyway, we should just go along with Peabody’s wet dream for next to no benefit to the community is the epitome of bass backwards thinking.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions